Growing Up With Arthritis

 

JA Transitions Podcast Episode Transcript
7/16/24

 

PODCAST OPEN:           

You’re listening to the Live Yes! With Arthritis podcast, created by the Arthritis Foundation to help people with arthritis — and the people who love them — live their best lives. This podcast and other life-changing resources are made possible by gifts from donors like you. If you’re dealing with chronic pain, this podcast is for you. You may have arthritis, but it doesn’t have you. Here, learn how you can take control of arthritis with tips and ideas from our hosts and guest experts.

 

MUSIC BRIDGE

 

Trina Wilcox:

Welcome to the Live Yes! With Arthritis podcast. My name is Trina Wilcox, and it’s a privilege to be here. I get to talk to other people who understand what it is like to grow up with arthritis. And I was diagnosed at 6. My parents had been trying for quite some time to figure out what was going on, which I have a feeling a lot of you can relate to that if you're a parent or the actual patient yourself.

 

It’s a lot to deal with and figure out, and there are so many transitions that go along with that. Which brings me to our topic today: We're going to be talking about JA transitions and what it's like to grow up. The things that you know are successes; the things that you stumble on; the things we're still learning.

 

And I am joined by two other folks that get this. It's kind of funny, collectively, we have experienced arthritis for 90 years together, so that's quite some time. So, without further ado, I want to welcome Claire Eby and Matthew Allman. Thanks for being here.

 

Claire Eby:

Thanks for having us.

 

Trina Wilcox:

We'll start with you, Claire. When were you diagnosed?

 

Claire Eby:

I was diagnosed at age 3, and it was the kind of thing where they didn't know what was wrong. And so, they just put my leg in a cast. They're like, "Oh, it's probably a fracture," which is not what you're supposed to do when you have arthritis. But they eventually figured it out and got a diagnosis. I actually grew up in a pretty small town, about two hours outside of Dallas, Texas. We would drive to Dallas every couple months for my pediatric treatment.

 

Trina Wilcox:

Do you remember much about that early diagnosis?

 

Claire Eby:

I don't think I ever remember a time of not having arthritis. This is just my life, and this is how it's always been. I guess lucky is maybe not the right term, but I feel fortunate.

 

Trina Wilcox:

I get what you're saying. I've had that feeling, too, someone diagnosed later. Along those lines, Matthew, what was it like for you when you got your diagnosis? How old were you?

 

Matthew Allman:

I want to say thank you for having me as well; really excited to be here. I was 12 or 13 when I was first diagnosed, but I'd been having symptoms of joint pain that I'd been complaining about for about five years prior to that. So, I remember when I was in elementary school, complaining about my knees and my ankles and my wrists hurting. But anytime I'd go to the pediatrician, it was like, "Oh, it's just growing pains, you'll grow out of it." When I was 10, I was diagnosed with Type 1 diabetes.

 

Trina Wilcox:

Oh, double whammy.

 

Matthew Allman:

I was still complaining about my joints hurting, but again, still being brushed off as it's just growing pains. When I was 12, one morning I woke up and my right knee was the size of a grapefruit. That was the cue for my mom to take me to the doctor again and say, “Hey, this is not just growing pains; let’s take a look at what's going on here.”

 

Trina Wilcox:

You were already going through becoming a teenager with all of those changes happening, and then you get this thrown in. How did you handle that?

 

Matthew Allman:

I had a really difficult, I guess, “teenagehood” … (laughs)

 

Trina Wilcox:

Yeah.

 

Matthew Allman:

… of dealing with my RA. Because a lot of times, now as an adult, people will be like, "What's JA?" And a lot of times they'll get it more if I say RA. "But you're so young." I'm like, "Oh, hey, let me tell you something: I've had it since I was like 8."

 

Trina Wilcox:

I learned that you can say adult juvenile idiopathic or rheumatoid arthritis, and I think I might adopt that. I don't know, because I feel the same way. I'm like, here I am a grown adult and I'm going juvenile, and they're, you know, “What?”

 

Matthew Allman:

 

Yeah, right?

 

Trina Wilcox:

Awkward. But Claire, when you were young and your friends were out playing, were you able to keep up? Or did you have those days where you felt like you were missing out?

 

Claire Eby:

I was pretty able to keep up. I was more of an indoor kid, so I think my experience might have been different if I had been more like outdoor-, athletically inclined. I did still play sports. I played tennis for a while, I did PE, I did all that. I was a big book kid, and I don't know if my arthritis influenced that, or if that was just something I really enjoyed. It's hard to say.

 

Trina Wilcox:

Were there any markers that you remember, like pivotal moments where you remember, "Hey, this is kind of getting in the way," whether it be like going to high school to adulthood. Any of those things that stand out in your mind that you're like, "Oh, this is a little inconvenient."

 

Claire Eby:

I lived in Texas, and there was a college I wanted to go to in Georgia. And I went to visit. And I remember visiting and saying to my mom, "Yeah, too bad I can't go here. It's too far from all my doctors." And then I ended up going there, so it worked out.

 

My arthritis experience was heavily influenced by uveitis, because I actually had a lot more trouble with my uveitis than I did my joint pain. Uveitis is an inflammation of the eyes, usually caused by the autoimmune disease that arthritis is connected with. And it can cause all sorts of bad inflammation. It can cause cataracts, glaucoma, just a lot of different things. That was something that I had more of a challenge with. But my local eye doctor actually knew of a good reference in the city that I was going to go to college in. And then that eye doctor was able to connect me with a good rheumatologist as well.

 

Trina Wilcox:

I'm glad you were able to make that happen. How about you, Matthew? What were those things where you were displeased with the diagnosis?

 

Matthew Allman:

Oh, that is a… (laughs)

 

Trina Wilcox:

One of many.

 

Matthew Allman:

… loaded question. Well, I had a really rough course. Sort of about halfway through middle school after I was diagnosed. And high school was really, really hard for me. I had a lot of really bad flare-ups. I was wheelchair-bound on and off over the course of a couple years throughout my sophomore year of high school and senior year of high school. Spent a lot of time in and out of the hospital with flare-ups.

 

Before being diagnosed, I did taekwondo and rock wall climbing, and I really enjoyed that. But with flare-ups and joint pain, paired with like weakness and stiffness and all of those other fun little symptoms that you get with JA, it made it really difficult for me.

 

Trina Wilcox:

Yeah.

 

Matthew Allman:

When it comes to school, I had a really hard time in classes with the symptoms, especially tied to my wrists and my fingers and my hands. I still struggle when it comes to using a pen, but that's just me. I'm uncoordinated to begin with, so like that doesn't help either. (laughs) Everybody's course with the disease is different. So, accommodations for me in high school were absolutely crucial. We were able to get a laptop for me to use in school, as well as a spare set of textbooks, extra time between classes.

 

And I'm really grateful for those accommodations. My mom was instrumental in making sure that I got the accommodations that I needed and working with my doctors. So, a 504 plan is a plan for accommodations made with your school and coordinated with your doctors as well. It involves coordination between the student, their parents or guardians and the school administrators, who are then supposed to disseminate it to all of your teachers if you've got multiple teachers, like in high school, where you're going from period to period there. It’s sort of like an IEP, or an individualized education plan.

 

Trina Wilcox:

Yeah. I remember being a freshman going from one hallway to a next, and a teacher slamming the door in my face when I couldn't book it down there, until I think my mom made the call and was like, “Uh-um.”

 

Claire Eby:

I can talk a little bit about the history of the 504 plan.

 

Trina Wilcox:

Yes, please.

 

Claire Eby:

So, a big part of the 504 plans became law. It's a federal law, so it should apply to every single public school in America, if I'm not mistaken. And that was passed during the Disability Rights Act. Judy Heumann, who recently passed I think this last year, she was a big advocate. And her book, “Being Human,” describes a lot about the 504 and like the big disability rights movement. It's an excellent, excellent book. That's what 504 is, like part of the Disability Rights Act — getting individualized education plans.

 

It's also really a big deal for people with arthritis because we have invisible disabilities. So, people will often look at us and be like, “Why would you need a 504?” And it's like, “Well, I have low vision and I need extra time on tests because I don't read as fast, because my vision was stunted growing up. I need things like that, or I need to sit at the front of the class so that I can see the board better.” Just little things like that. And like you were saying, extra time to get to your classroom is so essential.

 

PROMO:

If you want to learn more about juvenile arthritis and related diseases, count on the Arthritis Foundation. Explore our JA camps, the national JA Family Summit and other ways to stay in touch and be-in-the-know about everything JA, for juvenile arthritis. Visit arthritis.org/ja.

 

Trina Wilcox:

What were some of the other things when you were becoming more of an adult and the responsibilities started falling more on you? Because when we're younger, mom, dad, caregiver, is able to shoulder a lot of those phone calls, insurance, conversations and so on. What do you remember being some of those highlighted moments? When it was like, "Oh, this is my job now." (laughs)

 

Matthew Allman:

There were a lot of those moments, I feel. I'm really grateful that my mom sort of taught me to take ownership of my conditions and management of my conditions. It started for me with my Type 1 diabetes and learning how to do my own injections, or got an insulin pump, and then all of the training on that as well.

 

But when it came to arthritis, making sure you're taking your medications at the correct times each day. Having me, like, set up a pill box. It helps keep me in line, so a schedule. Getting set on a schedule and part of that childhood to adult transition there with chronic conditions.

 

Trina Wilcox:

How about you, Claire?

 

Claire Eby:

When I went to college, I ended up having a really big flare. It was really unusual, too, and a lot of that was just because I wasn't getting the right amount of sleep. I wasn't getting the right food. You know, when you're in college and you're not doing any of the stuff you're supposed to?

 

Trina Wilcox:

Yeah, right.

 

Claire Eby:

I just wasn't sleeping well. I wasn't eating super well. And that really had a huge effect on my body. And I ended up having a really bad flare. And I had to go on Humira. And that really was the biggest awakening for me about what I did not know. Because when you get on Humira, you have to go through a specialty pharmacy; you have to go through your insurance; you have to like do this whole rigmarole just to get this medication. It's nuts. And so, I learned like, "Oh, OK, I need to call the insurance and yell at the right person. Then I need to call the pharmacy and yell at that right person. And then I have to go pick it up.

 

I was pretty lucky, because my dad had been taking care of a lot of that kind of thing for me, and he was helping me make the phone calls and get the right person. But yeah. And also even just learning how to do the injections myself. Because when I started Humira, it was the old version that had the citrates in it that felt like a hot screwdriver in your leg.

 

Trina Wilcox:

Oh, Lord.

 

Claire Eby:

And I was not expecting that. My first time doing the injection did not go super well. I messed up; I pulled it out too early, and I was just like alone in my dorm room being like, "Ah!"

 

Trina Wilcox:

Oh, no.

 

Claire Eby:

This is not how it's supposed to go. (laughs)

 

Trina Wilcox:

Oh, my goodness.

 

Claire Eby:

Which I can laugh about now. I wish I'd done a couple things differently. I wish I'd gone to my doctor's office to do the injection the first couple of times, just to make sure I was doing it right. I just wish I had known a little bit more about how annoying insurance is.

 

Trina Wilcox:

After my first semester of college, they won't always do surgery until your body's done growing. So, I had to wait for a wrist surgery. So, we've got to plan this when I'm not in school, when I can recover. And that was just kind of like, "Oh, I have to throw my summer away to this." But thankfully, I had my parents close by, so that's been a big deal for me to have that help.

 

A transition I'm experiencing right now is that I'm meeting adults that have dealt with this since they were kids, you guys, and that's not been something that was accessible to me years ago, when I was a kid. The only people I knew who had arthritis were my grandparents. So, it's nice that this resource is available and that there are more resources available for parents and kids with arthritis, I think.

 

Claire Eby:

I agree, and I think destigmatizing invisible illnesses and chronic illness — it has a long way to go — but it's really come a long way. And that has really helped other people find each other. I'm able to actually go online. I can find people with disabilities talking about it openly on Instagram now, and that's extremely helpful to me personally, like I feel the emotional support there.

 

Trina Wilcox:

Yeah, I agree. Matthew, do you have anything to share?

 

Matthew Allman:

I will say I was really fortunate that after my diagnosis with JIA, my mom got me involved with the Arthritis Foundation locally. And I knew a couple other kids who had JIA as well. And it's just such a huge resource, that community, to not feeling isolated, because at your very local level, at your high school, you may be the only one with it. And it's just so isolating. And you feel like: Why is this happening to me? You'll get stares from people if you're having to use like a wheelchair or a walker.

 

I remember just getting stared at when I had to use the elevator to go upstairs. People are like, "Why are using the elevator? You're not allowed to use that. Only teachers can use them." Like, I have a pass for it, because I can't do the stairs and folks not understanding, who are your age. That peer-to-peer support there, it's huge.

 

Trina Wilcox:

It is huge and when I was a kid, I was scared to death to let anyone know. And it wasn't until I was probably … I started sharing with a few people in college and I was able to usually kind of hide stuff. Every now and then, someone would blurt out, “Why are you limping?” You know that awkward moment. But then I realized I cannot be ashamed of this. Because I don’t want someone else to feel like I felt before.

 

What about jobs? When you got that first, you know, big job, career job or passion project? Did you have any hurdles to jump over there?

 

Matthew Allman:

Oh, gosh, after college I went right into grad school. And right out of grad school, I got the job that I have currently. I’m still working in the same role, but in a civilian position now versus a contractor position. I was terrified to tell anybody that I had any chronic health issues, because I was worried that it would reflect negatively on me as an employee.

 

I always had to work harder to make up or catch up in school when I was dealing with flare-ups. So, I worked really, really, really hard through high school and then college. It reflected well in my grades and everything. I did a ton of extracurricular stuff. I was really lucky through college that I didn't have any major flare-ups.

 

It’s the way it is with JIA sometimes. You just sort of have to go with it as it ebbs and flows. But I was really afraid to tell anybody that I had JIA or, you know, Type 1 diabetes. After I got comfortable in my role and I realized that my health has nothing to do with how I am doing my job, because I'm doing great at my job, I know what I'm doing, I am competent.

 

I've never had any issues in my career because of my JIA. But back when I was working retail all through college, if I needed to go get a snack or a drink or something like that. And they're like, "Oh, well, you don't do a good job at this." Like, how do you know? Do you have my body? Do you live here with me? What? But it's wild, it's absolutely wild sometimes.

 

Trina Wilcox:

It takes so much more for us to get to our baseline. Claire, what was your experience like?

 

Claire Eby:

In my post-grad life, I've had a pretty good experience overall. I haven't really faced much discrimination, I don't think, or many issues with my job. It's pretty well known in a lot of disabled communities that you do not tell them about any of your disabilities or potential accommodations during the interview process. You tell them that after you get hired.

 

My first job out of college was working with the federal government. So, I was kind of like, "Come at me." They have very strict laws. Even outside of federal government, you can file an EEOC complaint if you experience discrimination. Knowing the rules can really help you out. And then I currently work at the Arthritis Foundation, so I don't think they're going to do anything. I think they believe me.

 

Trina Wilcox:

Very understanding, compassionate folks.

 

Claire Eby:

Yeah. But when I was in college, like you were saying with retail jobs, I worked a couple of small jobs. You would have thought I had asked for a $10 pay raise whenever I was like, "Can we get a stool back here?"

 

Trina Wilcox:

Yeah.

 

Claire Eby:

It took months to get a stool because they were like, "We don't want people sitting." It just took so long just to get a stool that I could sit, because my job was basically  promoting the school to any visitors. I was just waiting for visitors most of the time. I think I could still talk about the school pretty well if I was sitting down.

 

Trina Wilcox:

Yeah.

 

Claire Eby:

We had a situation where we had to evacuate because of a hurricane. And one thing I learned was you really need to have asked for more accommodations than you think you'll need. I had just gotten on Humira, which is a refrigerated medication, and I didn't know how long we were going to be evacuated for, so I had to take it with me. And getting accommodations for refrigeration was so weird and difficult.

 

So, I learned pretty quickly, like get more accommodations than you think you'll need, just in case, and try to get them as soon as possible. Because at the time, I hadn't had the accommodations in place yet for refrigeration for my medication. I believe you can call your high school and get them to send those accommodations to the university that you attend.

 

Trina Wilcox:

Great tips.

 

Matthew Allman:

I went to community college for two years before I transferred to my university. And going to my community college, my 504 plan did translate, and I would meet with their disability coordinator, usually once a semester at the beginning of the semester, to make sure that all of my accommodations went to the correct instructors that I had. And that all of my accommodations were still current. They should transfer, and there are folks at your schools that will help make sure that you are set up with what you need to be successful.

 

PROMO:

Over the past seven decades, the Arthritis Foundation has invested over $500 million into scientific research, advancing arthritis treatments while pursuing a cure. Progress is being made every day, thanks to the contributions of people like you. Learn more about our research initiatives at arthritis.org/science.

 

Trina Wilcox:

Do you have any tips when you learned to drive?

 

Claire Eby:

For me, it was vision-related because I have to wear glasses when I drive. I've a smaller peripheral field vision. Where it's just like, "OK, when you're looking in your side mirror, lean forward. Also, look in your side mirrors a little bit more frequently and like, definitely double, triple check. Drive extra carefully at night." Things like that. Temple College: They have a program where they make like disability-friendly clickers for your seatbelt.

 

There's like, a start engine that's a little bit easier to turn. If it's hard to get your fingers down to click on the seatbelt, they have a little keychain that helps you with that. So, there's all sorts of assistive devices out there that I highly recommend looking into.

 

Trina Wilcox:

Awesome, good one. Matthew?

 

Matthew Allman:

So, I don't know if I had any issues specifically related to that when I was first beginning to drive. I will have a hard time gripping the wheel with my fingers because they like to act up sometimes. It's just been that I found what works for me as I go along. I always drive really careful. And for me, I have to check my blood sugar before I drive. I always make sure that I'm good being a Type 1 diabetic as well. I wear a continuous glucose monitor.

 

Trina Wilcox:

Any other things that are on the top of your mind that you think someone transitioning through the years with JA would want to know? We'll start with you, Claire.

 

Claire Eby:

I have given up on high heels.

 

Trina Wilcox:

I never started. (laughs)

 

Claire Eby:

I wear them to one nice occasion a year and remember why I don't do that. And I fully give in to fashion tennis shoes. Just lean into it. There's so many cool fashion tennis shoes out there. There's like, sneaker heads. Sneaker head culture has really helped me be fashionable in tennis shoes. So, I highly recommend that, as you get more into exploring your own fashion and discovering what it is you like. Remember to be comfortable is essential.

 

Trina Wilcox:

Yes. How about you, Matthew?

 

Matthew Allman:

I think that the most pressing is probably to remember to be kind to yourself and be kind to your body. Because, while you don't always have control over it, sometimes you just need to go with the flow. And if your body's telling you that you need to stop for a minute and maybe go a little bit slower, that's OK. Life really is not a race.

 

Find your community. They are there to support you, too, even if it's just listening to the fact that you're struggling with insurance to get your medication or something along those lines. They get it. Community support is critical.

 

Trina Wilcox:

I think my takeaway would be along similar lines, you know, give yourself grace. Don't be embarrassed by what you are dealing with, and don't let it keep you from trying things. Be your own health advocate — relentlessly — because you're going to have to. Like you both shared, insurance is going to run you through the wringer, but that's OK. Do it. And find your people that will help you do it. And I think like you both shared, there's so much more available resource-wise.

 

Social media has been a double-edged sword. It can be very good for connecting and finding ways that you can find accommodations and other people.

 

The Arthritis Foundation puts up a question on social media before each episode. And this time, they asked: "What helped you or your child with arthritis get through the most difficult part of growing up with juvenile arthritis?" And before I share some, I'll ask if you have something that stands out for you, Claire?

 

Claire Eby:

I think my family had a really good humor about arthritis. I had friends who had really good humor about it. I did have some accommodations whenever I was playing tennis and in middle school. And one time like, a tennis ball came flying at me, and my friend was like, "She has arthritis!" But he was like joking.

 

Trina Wilcox:

Yeah, yeah.

 

Claire Eby:

This is the kind of humor I'm looking for.

 

Trina Wilcox:

Yeah, humor does wonders for sure. And family support. How about you, Matthew?

 

Matthew Allman:

I think the hardest thing about growing up with arthritis is when you're actively using accommodations and people think you don't look disabled enough.

 

Trina Wilcox:

Yeah, yeah.

 

Matthew Allman:

Especially adults. I remember a little while after I started driving and I had a handicap placard because I had limited mobility. I was going to park at my grandparents' condo, and I asked for a spot up closer. I showed my handicap placard, and I was told, "Oh, you must have your grandmother's placard, that can't be yours." And I'm like, "I have juvenile arthritis." "Oh, you're too young for that, you don't look disabled. You can't park there." I'm like, "Really?"

 

Trina Wilcox:

JL23 said she was diagnosed at 2 when medications were limited and a wheelchair was supposed to be part of her future. There were not a lot of support groups at this time; not access to the internet or information available. And so, she had support of her parents; the love and support from them; and they treated her normal. And it sounds like she had similar support.

 

She never stopped. Her parents fought for her for a second set of books at school. Those school accommodations, man, I love that. They continue to stay by her side with her first major surgery, a double hip replacement at 23. Wow. And she says she's persevered, and today she's a mother of two in her 40s. So, that is fantastic.

 

I am Robo girl said, “My mom, while still making sure I had everything I needed to battle arthritis.” She never felt weak or like she couldn't accomplish because her mom still expected the best. So, she's grateful. In hindsight, it would have been easier for her parents to baby her, but they didn't let her off the hook.

 

Sam Derizo 8 had “a supportive family, friends and a rheumatologist along the way. I think a great rheumatologist can do wonders as well. School accommodations was big, having the extra time to get assignments done when pain and fatigue were more than usual, or if hospitalized due to a flare. Also, had accommodations and housing accommodations in college.”

 

Kat Samuelson said, “Just listening” to his child. Oh, this is a big one: Listening to his child's fears and just saying things like, "I hear you, buddy," especially when it comes time to take medication or the shot, like, "You're not ready? Sure, we can wait. Tell me when you're ready."

 

C. Jones said, “Going to JA camp. Before camp, I felt so alone and honestly like a weirdo. I didn't know anyone else who was experiencing the same things as me, leading to feel embarrassed about having arthritis and needing shots and a wheelchair and other things to help me out. I hated when my mom or family would tell others about my arthritis. I didn't want pity, or for people to feel bad for me, but it was so scary feeling alone. Luckily, camp made me realize I wasn't alone and that people my age were going through the same things as me.”

 

Claire Eby:

I think it can be so hard because you don't see a lot of people using mobility devices. Using it is kind of awkward, but you also might be the person who is encouraging another person to use a mobility device.

 

Trina Wilcox:

Yes.

 

Claire Eby:

And if it gives you the independence that you need, then it's a great thing. I don’t want to be in pain. And if using a mobility device helps you and makes you feel better and gives you that independence, I highly encourage you to use it.

 

Trina Wilcox:

Matthew?

 

Matthew Allman:

I completely agree. That’s huge. I remember being embarrassed when I was in high school because I was using mobility aids at home. I was terrified to go to school with a mobility aid. I had this deep feeling that they were going to just stare at me. They're going to point me out and make fun of me because I'm using this. You know, people don't know. And to a certain extent, you can't fault people for not knowing what they don't know.

 

Trina Wilcox:

Yeah.

 

Matthew Allman:

But what you can do is you can educate them. So, growing up with my health conditions, my mom taught me to be an educator about them. So, it spreads awareness.

 

PROMO:

Biologics and biosimilars. What’s the difference? And what does it mean for you? It can be confusing. That’s why the Arthritis Foundation provides guidance on what to consider in your own situation. Get the facts from the arthritis community’s most-trusted source of information. Visit arthritis.org/biosimilars.

 

Trina Wilcox:

As we're wrapping up, if you could have three takeaways from this episode, what would they be? We'll start with you, Claire.

 

Claire Eby:

Oh boy. (laughs) I would say you're going to have to be a little bit outgoing. It’s going to be tough. But you should really try to learn as much as you can while you're at home. I hate saying that because, if somebody had said that to me at my age, I'd be like, "Oh, whatever." But I really mean it. (laughs) And my third takeaway, get to know other people with arthritis. Like I really enjoyed this conversation today, and it's been very encouraging, and it's just really nice to talk to you guys.

 

Trina Wilcox:

Yes. How about you, Matthew?

 

Matthew Allman:

My number one takeaway is find your community, get involved with your community. They're there to support you and help you. And whether it's the arthritis community or if you have another chronic health issue. I did some advocacy with the Arthritis Foundation as a teenager and that was really great for me to know and take sort of ownership of my condition. So, find your community, they're there to help you and support you.

Be kind to yourself, because every day is not going to be easy. There is no shame in resting; there's no shame in taking a breath and just having that time. And the third is that there are protections there for you as well, with your school, if you're going to college, work, depending on where you are. There are protections, whether it's ADA or like a 504 plan or different accommodations. Those are things that are available. And don't be afraid to access them.

 

Trina Wilcox:

Yeah, excellent. I've learned that there is the community out there. I would tell people to stay bold and brave, and part of being bold and brave is asking for help. We want to be as independent as we can, but use the accommodations to be independent and to make your life as happy and full as possible. And keep going, just keep going. So, thank you guys for a fantastic conversation. I have enjoyed this so much.

 

You can subscribe to The Live Yes! With Arthritis podcast on all platforms. Follow the Arthritis Foundation on social media. And always find resources at arthritis.org. Thank you so much for joining us. Take care.

 

Matthew Allman:

Thank you.

 

Claire Eby:

Thank you.

 

PODCAST CLOSE:

The Live Yes! With Arthritis podcast is independently produced by the Arthritis Foundation. Gifts from people like you make our podcast and other life-changing resources possible. You can donate at arthritis.org/donate. This podcast aims to help people living with arthritis and chronic pain live their best life. People like you. For a transcript and show notes, go to arthritis.org/podcast. Subscribe and rate us wherever you get your podcasts. And stay in touch!